LEILA FADEL, HOST:
As we heard there, President Trump told NBC News he asked Israel's prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, to pull back on its attacks on Lebanon, as these negotiations with Iran are expected to begin. For more on what this means for Israel, its fight against the Lebanese militant and political group Hezbollah and Iran, we turn now to Danny Citrinowicz. He served as head of the Iran branch of Israel's military intelligence. He is now senior researcher at the Institute for National Security Studies in Tel Aviv. Good morning, Danny, and welcome to the program.
DANNY CITRINOWICZ: Hi. Good morning, and good afternoon from Israel.
FADEL: I want to start with whether U.S. and Israeli goals align here. We heard there from Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, saying it's not planning to pull back on Lebanon. Do Israel - does Benjamin Netanyahu want this ceasefire?
CITRINOWICZ: Well, definitely, we have to first discuss the Iranian issue because the Lebanese issue is connecting to it. And for Iran, definitely, the targets now are not aligned. Israel has no intention or incentive to negotiate anything with Iran. Israel government believe that any negotiation with Iran just will strengthen the regime that it want to topple. So, actually, what happened is President Trump forced Israel 'cause Israel was not interested in stopping the war, but once President Trump decided to stop the war, we had to stop the war.
Now, this is one angle or one set of the problem. The other one is the fact that in order to secure or to prevent the Lebanese issue to become a problem in the negotiations, given the Iranian claim that Lebanon is included within the ceasefire, then Netanyahu has to - not even if not stopping the attacks in Lebanon, just to minimize them, because President Trump wants to see the negotiation in Islamabad actually succeeding. So Prime Minister Netanyahu find himself in a very problematic situation, given the fact that he's interested in continuing the war in Iran, but now there are negotiations, and he's interested in continuing the war against Hezbollah Lebanon, but he's forced to stop or to minimize the attacks because of the demand coming from the U.S. administration.
FADEL: That's interesting. So this is really because of President Trump's pressure that Netanyahu is scaling back or even supportive of the ceasefire at all.
CITRINOWICZ: Yes. And again, both leaders were very much aligned the beginning of the war and throughout the war. But I think towards the end, Israel really believes that attacking the infrastructure - the civilian infrastructure in Iran - this is something that really can prevent Iran from becoming a threat to state of Israel. But I think President Trump understands that the implication for that is much more than just on the Middle East, on the national economy and even on the U.S. markets. So he want to see whether there's going to be a possibility to reach an agreement with Iran. And again, I'll tell you a little secret, it's going to be very hard because Iranian think that they actually won the battle, so they're coming emboldened. But leave that aside, the thing is the President Trump want to see whether they're going to - there is some sort of a possibility to reach an agreement that Netanyahu really doesn't want to see. And I think Netanyahu is hoping that the negotiation in Islamabad collapse and there will be a return back to the war.
FADEL: So where does this all leave Prime Minister Netanyahu's objectives in this moment if these negotiations are going ahead?
CITRINOWICZ: Well, he - I have to say that he changed the targets of the war during the war itself. Beginning, it was definitely - they talked about undermining the current regime, talking about toppling the regime, using the air campaign and also activities by the Mossad that actually meant to topple this regime. Now, when they (ph) - or Israel and also the U.S. understood, mainly in Israel that it's not going to happen, then he changed the targets of the campaign, making sure that actually, it will be a success regardless of what will happen. And then he mentioning the undermining of, you know, the conventional force buildup of Iran.
So in that regard, he can always say, we won, we had objectives, and we actually implement them. But the problem is that even - you've seen in the Israeli polls, that people in Israel understand that this war was not a success as Prime Minister Netanyahu trying to portray that. And so it's another element why - another reason why Prime Minister Netanyahu hoping that there will be a return for the campaign, and maybe then he can achieve the goals. But I think that for now, the U.S. president is seeking to reach an agreement.
FADEL: And really quickly, do you have any optimism about these talks this weekend (ph)?
CITRINOWICZ: I have to say I'm very skeptical. The ball is in the U.S.' court because the Iranians are coming emboldened from the war itself, feeling that actually they had the upper hand. I think at the end of the day, they weren't going to show any compromises, and it's all connected to the U.S. If the U.S. will insist that it will seize their 15 points in beginning, I think the chances of reaching...
FADEL: That - unfortunately, I have to leave it there. That's Danny Citrinowicz...
CITRINOWICZ: Yeah.
FADEL: ...Former head of the Iran branch of Israel's military intelligence. Thank you for your time.
CITRINOWICZ: Thank you very much. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
NPR transcripts are created on a rush deadline by an NPR contractor. This text may not be in its final form and may be updated or revised in the future. Accuracy and availability may vary. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.
